Right? It seems there was some self-awareness that that term flattened very diverse segments of society into an annoying-sounding catchall. Some people do appear to be advocating a return to simply referring to people by their main group identity (black, Hispanic, etc.), which I suppose is probably the best we can do for now. Though I do hope one day these descriptors start to mean less and less in terms of how Americans view each other -- that we start to think of concepts like "black" as describing a group of people who may have shared cultural connections but who see themselves foremost as part of a shared American identity (not all that dissimilar to the idea of Irish Americans or Italian Americans as their own cultural groups).
The "who makes the rules, anyway?" comment particularly resonated with me; it's notable that even a Times columnist is saying that now. I don't want to be referred to as a "person of colour" ( https://loveofallwisdom.com/blog/2019/10/let-non-white-be-non-white/ ) but nobody ever *asked* me. I've almost never seen any actual democratic deliberation where people sit down together and ask the genuine question "what terms do we think we should use?", even as one group - let alone then have more deliberation that involves people who weren't part of that group.
Fascinating, thank you! The African-American versus black debate is decades old at this point, but what rarely come up is the "American" specificity of the former which is often relevant. A Jamaican or Nigerian could be black but not African American. Jazz is an African American cultural treasure, not generically black. Not to be all pedantic and English teacher-y, but there is a distinction. It often strikes me as American ethnocentricity to claim the color as representing an American racial group when in fact it applies to millions around the world. The terms are not interchangeable! But word usage is so interesting partly because it doesn't follow the rules, annoying as that is for English teachers.🤓
What a wonderful comment, thank you! Yes, the debate over those two terms is an interesting one. I *think* they both came organically from America's black population, which is at least a good thing. It seems these terms are likely the best we have for now, but it'll get interesting as the country grows more multiracial. I know some folks like Coleman Hughes argue that the way America thinks about race is already pretty outdated and unhelpful.
Yes! I'm white on the outside (inverse Oreo lol) but grew up in the DC area in the '70s with black friends and later in Chicago. Black was (and still is for some) a derisive term within the community (e.g. your mama's so black jokes) but was famously made proud by James Brown (Say it loud!). In Chicago I worked with immigrant African and black/African American communities, and they definitely made distinctions between their identities and cultures. Fascinating topic, thanks again!
I have been wanting to write a piece like this for awhile—now I don’t need to! Excellent piece I shared on Facebook and with my Texas No Labels group. Will restack with a Note when I am at my computer. Well written!
I had no idea that "BIPOC" was out. Luckily I never used it in the first place. What have the powers that be replaced it with?
Right? It seems there was some self-awareness that that term flattened very diverse segments of society into an annoying-sounding catchall. Some people do appear to be advocating a return to simply referring to people by their main group identity (black, Hispanic, etc.), which I suppose is probably the best we can do for now. Though I do hope one day these descriptors start to mean less and less in terms of how Americans view each other -- that we start to think of concepts like "black" as describing a group of people who may have shared cultural connections but who see themselves foremost as part of a shared American identity (not all that dissimilar to the idea of Irish Americans or Italian Americans as their own cultural groups).
The "who makes the rules, anyway?" comment particularly resonated with me; it's notable that even a Times columnist is saying that now. I don't want to be referred to as a "person of colour" ( https://loveofallwisdom.com/blog/2019/10/let-non-white-be-non-white/ ) but nobody ever *asked* me. I've almost never seen any actual democratic deliberation where people sit down together and ask the genuine question "what terms do we think we should use?", even as one group - let alone then have more deliberation that involves people who weren't part of that group.
Fascinating, thank you! The African-American versus black debate is decades old at this point, but what rarely come up is the "American" specificity of the former which is often relevant. A Jamaican or Nigerian could be black but not African American. Jazz is an African American cultural treasure, not generically black. Not to be all pedantic and English teacher-y, but there is a distinction. It often strikes me as American ethnocentricity to claim the color as representing an American racial group when in fact it applies to millions around the world. The terms are not interchangeable! But word usage is so interesting partly because it doesn't follow the rules, annoying as that is for English teachers.🤓
What a wonderful comment, thank you! Yes, the debate over those two terms is an interesting one. I *think* they both came organically from America's black population, which is at least a good thing. It seems these terms are likely the best we have for now, but it'll get interesting as the country grows more multiracial. I know some folks like Coleman Hughes argue that the way America thinks about race is already pretty outdated and unhelpful.
Yes! I'm white on the outside (inverse Oreo lol) but grew up in the DC area in the '70s with black friends and later in Chicago. Black was (and still is for some) a derisive term within the community (e.g. your mama's so black jokes) but was famously made proud by James Brown (Say it loud!). In Chicago I worked with immigrant African and black/African American communities, and they definitely made distinctions between their identities and cultures. Fascinating topic, thanks again!
I have been wanting to write a piece like this for awhile—now I don’t need to! Excellent piece I shared on Facebook and with my Texas No Labels group. Will restack with a Note when I am at my computer. Well written!
Thanks so much, Mary Beth!
What year did you graduate from Winnetonka?
2009! Coming up on 15 years, which is crazy to think about.